THE DEBATE GOES ON. I’ve never struggled so much to write a motorcycle article as I have with this one. A reader challenged me to enter the discussion about loud pipes earlier this year. At the time, I thought it an easy endeavor because I had my own years of experience and opinion on the matter.
However, I made a mistake: I decided to research the matter. And in the process, my opinion has been somewhat modified.
The Search for Evidence: “Loud Pipes Save Lives”
As you, too, might be inclined to do when seeking more info on a subject, I did an Internet search for “Loud Pipes Save Lives” and read through numerous articles at the top of the search results and much lower in the results.
What I came away with was less certainty on the subject than when I started. And more so than any time before, I recognized that truth can be illusive.
Now I don’t know if my personal experience is typical, or atypical, but I did ride for years with high-performance (and loud), exhaust pipes – when I was much younger. To this day, I don’t know how my ears survived. (Well, the fact is, now that I’m considerably more mature, the question of how well they survived is just as murky as my research on the matter of whether loud pipes save lives, or not.)
Although it appears my hearing is not as good as it used to be, how much of that is due to loud pipes or lots and lots of very loud concerts and very loud music blasting through headphones is difficult to discern. I’m sure it’s safe to say that neither supported long-term optimal hearing. (I only started wearing ear plugs while riding several years ago).
Loud Pipes Are Impractical For Long-Distance Touring
My first coast-to-coast motorcycle trip was on a motorbike with a high-performance, non-stock exhaust system that did not endear the neighbors to my notion of a spirited form of transportation. Although I’ve ridden coast-to-coast across North America a number of times since, I recall that first trip as a highlight of my life. And although I could discourse about the virtues of that summer adventure, in the early 80’s, for hours on end, one thing that I realized without any advice, feedback or suggestions from anyone else, was that loud pipes made for uncomfortable long-distance riding (and also that I would be switching from chain-drive to shaft-drive motorbikes for touring).
Personally, I don’t like loud pipes. As much as I love each and every kind of motorcycle, the only ones that diminish my enthusiasm for the brotherhood are those that disrupt the neighborhood harmony by announcing their every breath coming and going.
So, here I am, a long-distance, mature rider, with hundreds of thousands of miles of motorbike experience, who “used” to ride with loud pipes, and who has not liked them for years, and who is philosophically opposed to them due to their inherent and ongoing damage to the motorsport in the way they impinge on the lives of those non-riders whom are adversely effected by the noise pollution of their very existence. Hence, wouldn’t you think I’d be a vociferous opponent of the same?
Which brings me to the point of the first paragraph. I was already aware of the lack of real evidence that supports the concept that “loud pipes save lives.”
But lo and behold, my research did find anecdotal reports that extol the virtues of loud pipes.
The Truth, or Not?
So, what is the truth?
Are those riders who state that loud pipes “have” saved their lives just plain wrong?
What my research did “not” do is change my perspective on whether I, personally, will integrate loud pipes back into my riding: I won’t. In fact, in the future, I will likely include an electric motorcycle (which are practically silent), within a stable of riding choices.
However, what has resulted from my research regarding loud pipes is a softening of my perspective. Even though scientifically unproven, if riders’ lives have been saved because of loud pipes, or if riders believe they are safer with loud pipes, those are some compelling factors – at least for those individuals.
Even so, such does not address the rights of others to “not” be subjected to the noise of loud motorcycle exhaust systems.
In conclusion, although I am not an advocate for loud pipes, and even though I disagree with the use of the most obnoxious ones, and even though there is no hard evidence in support of their use as a safety catalyst, and even though the loudest pipes do damage to the overall public perception of motorcycling, I respect that there have been “some” quantity of riders (however large or small), who are still riding, purportedly as a result of loud pipes. Which has caused me to re-evaluate their application.
Better yet, what do YOU consider is the truth? Do loud motorcycle pipes save lives?
Dan, well said and far further reaching than just loud pipes and motorcycles. If we had more people with your attitude in this country, then the USA would still be the country I grew up loving… Unfortunately too many people in this country now vote with their hand out asking what are you going to give me. In exchange they are willing to forfeit all of their freedoms for what they perceive as “free stuff”, but what really is stuff I pay for and the government gives to them to bribe them…
We will find out in 2014 and again 2016 if there is enough true Americans left in this country of if this experiment in Liberty has failed… Keep riding and keep fighting…
well said DAN … but it was the h.d. NO pipes pack ..AND the track pipe sport bike 10,000 + rpm that said hey look at me here I am pissing your ears off .. me over here the guy on a motorcycle .. see I am the one doing it ….so everyone pays now … sound meters naaa just say after market pipe’s need CAFE ok .. so you get stopped BECAUSE of the here I am loud pipe and ” sir what year is this oh ok.. lets see non stock pipes with no dot/CAFE stamp .ok I see.!. ” .. ”after market loud pipes ticket ” ??? ” well NO BUT your screwing up the air ” so here the ticket for that instead…no muss no fuss no sound meter no training / schooling ..have a nice day …it’s all about the $$$$$ in the peoples rep of calif ….and they want yours and your gave them the excuse to get it …no noise must be stock = dot /café ok …so dan live free and broke ..
Ahhhh….Steve McQueen!
It’s interesting that Steve McQueen is so often fondly remembered for simply being the freedom loving, American individual that he was. He just lived his life the way he wanted….as all Americans used to be able to do….and he didn’t have to worry too much about what other people thought about it….unlike the present oppressive climate of political correctness, fostered by the radical left wingers, and foreign born politicians.
Remember those “good old days”…when whiny liberals like Al Gore, Ted Kennedy, the Clintons, Pelosi, Feinstein, or that socialist, dictator-wanna-be, obama, didn’t cry about absolutely everything that they don’t like?…or want some new law passed to “save the environment….the children…the whales…Roy’s hearing”….whatever?  Â
Unfortunately, those joyful days are long gone….all part of the “War Room” inspired, divide-and-attack Clinton legacy.Â
As the “rapier witted” Roy, of Daytona Beach Bike Week fame, so astutely pointed out….now, EVERYTHING is political, and in an oppressive, obama-loving environment…such as the state of “Mexi-fornia”….inhabited by criminal mexicans, sexual deviants, and radical left wings socialists, they pass law after law to restrict anything, and everything, that THEY don’t agree with.
Roy points out that now there are fines for “too loud” exhaust noise…of course, there always were, but the law was seldom enforced, be it loud cars, trucks, or motorcycles. His blaming “H.D. riders” is missing the point….it’s isn’t “H.D. riders”, it ruthlessly oppressive liberals forcing their own opinions down the throats of everyone else….don’t agree?…wait until 2014 when EVERYONE will also face fines for NOT “buying” the MANDATORY “correct health insurance”….fines brought about by those same freedom stealing, dishonest, socialists presently inhabiting…probably illegally…the White House.
Is that FACT “too loud” for you big-twin haters?
Put down the liberal Kool-Aide, and think a moment…your minds should clear shortly, and a “light bulb” might come on over your head, and you’ll “get it”…though I admit, it was a lot quicker to light that “light bulb”, when it was incandescent instead of the present….forced on everyone by the tyrannical obama regime….curly, flourescent bulbs that cost ten times as much to buy….”it ain’t the bikers”, it’s radical socialists just looking for another “bandwagon” to leap on, and take more freedoms away from all Americans….part of that “hopey-changey-transform-America” thingy that’s been such a costly disaster for everything it touches.
“WE”…bikers, that is….should remember that people like Steve McQueen would be looked down on and criticized today by the snooty “blue-state-save-the- environment types” for daring to enjoy the FREEDOM to ride his dirt bikes in the desert…something that liberals…such as the dishonest Al Gore, Bill Clinton, Hillary, or obama….(actually, stick in any modern day, lying democrat ), with their phony “man caused global warming”…OOPS!…that one didn’t work so now it’s “climate change”….and their oppressive agenda to stop EVERYTHING that anyone else might enjoy…. but that THEY just don’t like….”so let’s pass ANOTHER law!”
These types of hypocrites just don’t understand…or care, really…. that there ARE actually people who LOVE motorcycles…and, in particular, big V-Twin motorcycles, such as Harleys, Victorys, Big Dogs, and in general anything with a big, 45 degree, V-Twin engine. We like looking at them, talking about them, reading about them, riding them, and LISTENING to them….but liberals don’t, so they constantly complain about them…and imply that there is something “wrong” with people that do…and they want it stopped!….so they try the same old, worn out, feeble liberal attack of saying that big twin motor lovers are “compensating” for something….implying that there is some sexual “shortcoming”, so to speak, of men who like the sounds of big V-Twin engines…but then, how do they explain the growing number of FEMALE big twin lovers….such as “Christine” who posted here…and got rudely, and vulgarly attacked for expressing her opinion, by one of those same, dishonest, whiny liberals I speak of?
Personally, I feel just the opposite. I…like Steve McQueen…just want to live my life, enjoy what I can of it, and ride my V-Twin Harley Night Train. I have asked numerous police officers, and over a dozen car drivers, stopped next to me at red lights, if my exhaust is “too loud” (I have the Screamin’ Eagle slip on muffers)….and, to date, NOT ONE policeman, nor car driver…young, old, male, female,….has said “Yes, it’s too loud”….in fact, just the opposite, with compliments such as “sweet”…”great”…and most recently…”PERFECT!”, with an accompanying “thumbs up” signal of approval.
So, how about giving up that very lame, liberal innuendo that all “loud pipes” riders are “compensating” for something….maybe it’s YOU liberals that are “compensating” because you have been brow beaten, and brain washed so long, that you are simply so timid, or have such a low sense of self esteem, that you are in fear of being noticed, being judged politically incorrect, or possibly drawing any unwanted attention to yourself from anyone that MIGHT not like what YOU choose to enjoy, for fear of being kicked out of the so-called “big tent” of the fantasy known as “liberal acceptance”…so you try to “melt” into the background, and not “bother” anyone. and just “disappear”….how about doing all of America a favor, and do that very thing come next election day.
And, blaming all “H.D. riders” is missing the point.Â
All “H.D. riders” don’t ride around with obnoxiously loud pipes…in fact, it’s actually a small percentage of the overall volume of Harley riders that do that…but, that is the way current liberals operate….they pick a target….demonize them….and pass a new, freedom stealing law that hurts ALL motorcyclists, because they simply will NOT stop there….they do it with gun bans, “Big Gulp” soda sales, the infamous California “Twinkie Tax”, the list is practically endless….they’re lying, dishonest ,despicable people…. but that’s how they operate and steal all our freedoms, one by one….and, with the help of the totally dishonest, lying, liberal mass media… they’re “winning”….and all of America is losing.
I like my Harley, and the “loud pipes”….and the only “compensating” I am doing is trying to counter the dangerous, cell phone using, distracted, incompetent vehicle drivers from trying to take up the same space that I am presently occupying, or shortly INTEND to occupy, by aurally alerting them to the fact that I am nearby….SO LOOK!….not to mention simply enjoying that “magically delicious” big twin music as I glide down the highways, and byways of America….before riding motorcycles is judged “too risky to allow”, and is outlawed by the present, tyrannical regime, using the “authority” granted to them…by them… under the political monstrosity known as “obama-care”.
Steve McQueen, would…I’m sure….approve.
all this back and forth for years ..b/s. now its time to reap what you have sew …well them in the peoples repb of calif ..are now reaping the h.d. open pipe look at me … with CARB fining big $$$ not only to the riders but the muffler makers in calif ….for just selling them even though it says ” for off road use only ” ..thank you h.d. riders and bring $$ on your rides
Steve McQueen would have stood out and “ruled” on a silent GoldWing or an electric Harley. He wouldn’t have needed loud pipes to compensate.
Thanks Vern, you are absolutely right…the movie WAS “Tombstone”…now, why am I NOT surprised that a “pistolero” like you knows that?…LOL
And Roy, thanks for “confirming” ( I think ) that I said…..
“yeah, I know…McQueen didn’t really make the actual jump either….does that really matter?….after all, McQueen never actually claimed that HE made the jump…”
movie yes …but as a triumph owner ..well I had to get the record right , clear, and balanced, ..and mc queen never said he did it ,he all ways gave credit to who did , he’s friend and fellow rider bud elkens I think… that’s why mc queen will all ways be one of the few ”holly-weed stars ” who was a rider first and play actor ..3rd..unlike the fake ”stars” and pol-low-tick ones that are out there now….
Good morning, Dan.
The movie was “Tombstone” not Tucson….. Other than that, I liked you post. LOL
What a worthless article. I read it because it was supposed to be based on fact but instead was based on your personal opinion. Who cares if you like loud pipes or not! They may not save lives but they sure make motorist aware that you are present. I ride a Harley, and no, it does not have loud pipes.
Let me share my own anecdotal experience from several years back. Traveling down highway 70 through Kansas in the back of a van I heard this rumbling and no, it wasn’t in front of me, but behind me. It was indeed a Harley with obnoxious pipes but I knew he was there. Get the picture? Whether loud pipes saves lives or not, they sure make everyone around them know that they are there.
Please don’t bother to respond. I am terminating my subscription to this amateurish site.
LOUD PIPES SAVE LIVES!
Used Cushman motor scooter…March, 1963….wasn’t even close to being old enough for a license, and illegal as hell…didn’t matter….it had two wheels AND a motor…
Doug, I would expect someone like you to brazenly “stand by my statements”, even though there are MANY that are just flat out lies….like I’ve said, liberals will never admit the truth, even when everyone around them can see that they have been caught in a lie….look at your “hero” obama and the debates…caught red handed lying about WHY oil production was high…and it was NOT due to anything he was doing, in fact, just the opposite….yet, like all lying liberals, he continued to claim credit for it…and of course, being a dishonest liberal, YOU keep supporting that lie, and all the others he continues to tell….he’s a liar…you back him up…therefore YOU are a liar.
He still claims “credit” for ending the Iraq war, and “bringing home the troops”, when, in fact, Bush signed the agreement…back in 2008….that stated the end date, and that the American troops would leave by 31 December, 2011…obama had NOT taken office at that point, and was NOT responsible for either of those two things…yet, the dishonest obama lied, taking credit for them, and used those lies in actual dishonest campaign ads…and NOT ONE of the lying, obama butt kissing members of the dishonest, liberal mass media pointed that FACT out.
Same with the Benghazi murders…obama claimed that he had specifically called the Benghazi attack a “terrorist attack”, when in fact that was a total lie…and he continued to maintain for two more weeks that it was because of an anti muslim video…looking like a “deer caught in the headlights”, even the lying liberal “moderator”, Candy Crowley could see obama was trapped, and stepped in to lie, and save his sorry ass…then admitted the next day that she was “wrong”, and Romney was correct….and the lies obama and Hillary continued to tell about what really happened…even making a totally dishonest video blaming THE OTHER video for the attacks, when they both knew the truth about how the Americans were murdered…yet they didn’t have then, and don’t have now, the integrity to admit that they were totally incompetent in the matter, and totally CLUELESS about what should have been done PRIOR to the fatal attack that would have prevented the murders….guess you still believe them though…after all you are a liberal too.
Deny it all you want, you HAVE lied on this forum, and you ARE a liar, and, worst of all, you insult and try to bully other posters on here, simply because they disagree with you about what YOU call “loud pipes”, as if their opinion has to pass YOUR approval.
Once again, as you’ve done several times, you refer to MY “lies and distortions”….just which “lies and distortions” are you referring to Doug?…I’ve asked you to point them out…show me ONE deliberate “lie or distortion” that I have posted….you keep saying that, so show one of them to me….if you can’t, then the fact that you keep saying it means that you are LYING…AGAIN!
You don’t even have the integrity to stop lying when you are making some type of false “withdrawal” from replying to my posts, which is most likely impossible for you…it’s a compulsion for you….you’re a weasel.
P.S. Well Roy, that’s true…and it wasn’t really WWII either…it was a movie…a fictional story…just like Doug’s….and I certainly appreciate your attention to factual detail.
But that’s not the point…the image of the “American prisoner”… McQueen… racing around on a stolen “German” motorcycle…the Triumph….and putting out all that effort to escape and evade the “German” soldiers….just like Doug when he was “escaping and evading” all those “low-rent rednecks, and rich Republican soccer moms”, that where trying to do him “bodily harm”….. then making that jump was exciting, and will last a long, long time….yeah, I know…McQueen didn’t really make the actual jump either….does that really matter?….after all, McQueen never actually claimed that HE made the jump….
About that “left-right is as you sit on it” thing of yours…..if that’s how you ride a horse it might explain a lot about you….tell me….is his head in front of you, or in back?
dan-o, i have been riding since 1967. if you have been riding longer, good on ya. not gonna bother responding to all your other lies and distortions. i stand by my first statement – no lying from me.
mc queen did not use a german bike it was a triumph ..that said .like a horse or car left-right is as you sit on it …so I got that …no 303 sold them all ….223 time zone …thanks coming vs. going sure make’s it harder ..with no help from anyone ..I must act .times a wasting ..right is right and ,left is left ..left gets no holes as they are for gun control ..right gets blasted …45acp and 9mm ..so I have noise for safety and quiet for happy time p.c…..there that’s it ..everyone happy now …no bad comments as there was no help from anyone … live with it …noff said
Well, I’m making an effort to understand “new-speak” so I can appreciate Roy’s satire.
And, while I don’t have to make an effort to understand Dan’s “old speak”, effort is required to take in its voluminousness.
These herculean efforts on my part are more than worthwhile on a day with yet another rainy cold front moving through. But I warn you both – if spring actually comes, and the riding dam finally bursts, I may have to suspend my attention for a while.
I just hope Roy can select his ordinance by then, as I may well by out of effort. Luckily for me, Doug isn’t worth any effort.
Doug posted”
“yust to set the record straight. i have not posted even a single falsehood to this forum. yust cuz someone doesn’t like the truth, and can only respond by saying it is lies, doesn’t make it lies.”
Well, your “record” is just about as warped and twisted as the next lie that comes out of obama’s mouth….but at least it won’t cost taxpayers another trillion dollars down the rat hole…a big, fat Kenyan, jungle rat hole. lol
“Not posted a single falsehood to this forum?”…..Sure you have Doug….in fact the first post of yours that I read…which was about the Hurt Report studies….was very good….until you tried the old, dishonest liberal trick of “spinning” something that wasn’t there, to make it “appear” to, somehow support YOUR opinion…
You wrote…”…The only mention about conspicuity was confined to visual. Bright colors or farings and windshields. There was no time that the Hurt study ever mentioned loud exhausts., or found this as a contributing factor to safety. With the searching they did for common themes, if loud pipes were a legitimate factor in safety they would have identified this.
So, while your mistaken feelings about their findings IS understandable, still, you used the common old liberal tactic of taking something that ISN’T there ….( any mention of loud exhausts )….and spun that fact ( no mentioning ) so as to IMPLY that, because it WASN’T mentioned, THAT “proved” your argument AGAINST “loud pipes” having ANY impact on safety….which is simply NOT true, or at least that is NOT what was ever written in the Hurt report. The truth IS that “loud pipes” simply were NOT taken into account into their thinking.
…”proving” nothing.
Now, while I do NOT think you were actually telling a lie, I do think that you were being deliberately dishonest about the findings of the report, to bolster YOUR denial that “loud pipes” have ANY impact on….or the avoidance of….motorcycle accidents.
This is the same dishonest tactic that liberals used in the Roe v. Wade abortion case, dishonestly claiming it was a “constitutional right”. They took a “negative fact” (something that actually IS NOT there, i.e. “a woman’s right to privacy”, and used THAT non existent “constitutional right” , to say a woman has the right to take another human’s life due to that “constitutional right”….that isn’t even IN the constitution. They did the same thing with the non existent “separation of church and state” ‘right’ that, also, is NOT in the constitution.
The government can pass any laws it wants to, but to use non existent “facts” to claim that is the basis of a new law is simply dishonest…as was YOUR implied claim that the Hurt report supported your opinion against “loud pipes”.
On September 29, you said….”but, what excessively loud pipes *do* have an effect on, is the irritation of the general public. this may actually increase the danger to motorcyclists – while, in almost 40 years of riding, i have had my share of incidents w/inattentive cagers, the most dangerous incidents i have had involve cagers deliberately trying to inflict bodily harm on me, by trying to purposely cut me off, run me off the road, etc…”
Now, again you have used the “mythical” example of just how “loud pipes”…on OTHER rider’s bikes….. have impacted YOUR safety while riding, by causing “irritation” of drivers, who, seeing you on a “non obnoxiously loud” bike, try to “inflict bodily harm….purposely cut me off….run me off the road, etc”….
While I realize that your wild claims MIGHT possibly be true, I find them practically impossible to believe….especially since you state “the most dangerous incidents” involved “trying to purposely cut me off, run me off the road, etc”….
Now, the word “incidents” implies MORE than ONE incident…and the “etc” following your second “incident” of “run me off the road”, implies AT LEAST three or more “incidents”…
Now, I have actually been riding LONGER than you, and I have NEVER had even ONE “incident” where an “irritated” driver did those things…and I doubt that any other posters on this thread have either…and, if they have, I bet the rest of us, would probably be very interested in the details…i.e. what kind of car or truck, where did it happen, when, country or city, day or night, dirt road or highway…how did you escape, etc….sounds like you’re a “true veteran” of the very valuable “escape and evade maneuvers for motorcyclists”….I can’t help but conjure up exciting images of Steve McQueen ripping around and jumping his German, World War Two motorcycle in the movie, “The Great Escape”!….HEY!…maybe you could write a book! lol
Then, on December 2, in attacking a post of mine which showed repeated evidence that “facts” you had used to praise obama where NOT TRUE, you made false, misleading, and deliberately dishonest claims…in other words you LIED, about claims obama had made saying HE was responsible for the increased oil production….when he has actually done just the opposite by shutting down off shore oil drilling in the Atlantic, the Gulf of Mexico, and on government controlled land….so, while oil production IS up, it is because of drilling on STATE OWNED land, and privately owned land….land that your lying socialist dictator-wanna-be had no power over….
Now, you COULD have checked on these FACTS yourself, and not just trusted the obama regime, and it’s lap dogs in the liberal media falling all over themselves to praise him…but you didn’t…you preferred to attack me with witless insults such as “lame, neanderthal, bigot, ignorant”, etc….while continuing to get that infamous “tingle up your leg” anytime you hear your “messiah” speak.,,,,just like the lying liberal host of “Hardball”, Chris Matthews. Then, of course, there’s the Benghazi murders that obama, and the lying old hippy hag, Hillary, are directly responsible for, and the NON COVERAGE of this disgraceful story PRIOR to the election, so as not to hurt obama-yama….you claimed there was basically nothing to it, and that the only reason I, or any conservative, was interested was because we didn’t like your incompetent obama….when, in reality, we DON’T like obama BECAUSE HE IS such a liar and an incompetent,,,,hates the constitution, and basically all of America….and let those four Americans be murdered…get it?
So, while I could go on and on with plenty more recent examples, my point is…your are a liar…have posted numerous false, dishonest statements, and, if you weren’t such a nasty, mean spirited, liberal “cyber bully”, who seems to think that you can attack anyone that disagrees with you…including women like Christine….with profanity, call them names and insult their intelligence, with impunity, when they have done NOTHING to you, in ANY way…other than to express a simple opinion….which just happens to disagree with yours….. I, and the rest of us…I presume…could just ignore your hateful, pompous, boasting, deceitful posts., and let it go…but, that is NOT the case here.
So, this is how I will answer your most recent post, in which you said……
“and i am done arguing w/such low-life’s. as the saying goes, it is stupid to fight w/a pig – you will only get dirty and the pig likes it.”
For such a liar, and a man of such low character, and manners as you …whose opinion is absolutely worthless to me…to call me a “low-life” is simply a “badge of honor” for me….and I welcome it….and, while I certainly don’t consider myself a “pig”, you are correct about one thing….I damn sure do like “fighting” with thugs, bullies (both real and cyber), liars, dishonest liberals who pass themselves off as “caring” about ANYTHING except grabbing more and more freedoms, choices, rights, and tax money from the rest of us….always using the excuse “it’s for the children…the environment…the planet…the poor…yada…yada…yada….
Ride your damn bike…keep it as quiet as you can…but leave the rest of us alone, and let us enjoy OUR bikes the way we want to….is that possible for you, Doug?
Sorry if this offends anyone else…this is between Doug, and I…so, if it does…I probably don’t like you anyway….lol
LOUD PIPES SAVE LIVES!
Wow Roy, made in England. Before or after the Iron Lady? I’m guessing before.
British blacksmithery is not for everyone, but in deference to it’s historical significance, how about a .303 round?
As to right versus left, this is further complicated for you by the fact that an old Triumph was built to ride on the left side of the road. When you bring one over the pond to drive on the right, does it create a reverse image or a mere reflection?
And to complicate things further, one needs to get general agreement among your audience as to which pipe is left and which is right – otherwise you risk having your message misinterpreted (and I’m not talking here of new -vs- old speak. The pipe that is a bike’s left pipe when it is running at me is the bike’s right pipe as it departs.
yust to set the record straight. i have not posted even a single falsehood to this forum. yust cuz someone doesn’t like the truth, and can only respond by saying it is lies, doesn’t make it lies.
and i am done arguing w/such low-life’s. as the saying goes, it is stupid to fight w/a pig – you will only get dirty and the pig likes it.
carry on…
doug s.
fred thank you for understanding my prob ….but it is metric nuts and bolts but a made in England triumph so maybe 9mm and 45acp …would do it … but the question remains right muffler or left muffler …..oh my head hurts with the yes -no-right-left I do so do not want to get doug upset …peace
Roy, I see your dilemma.
Is your bike “metric”? If so, then perhaps a 9mm would be the right choice.
Interesting that you can embrace PC on occasion. Probably a healthy thing.
My advice then? If you want to be PC, just be careful not to damage the catalytic converter!
well ok…. I think I will take a pistol and shoot holes in one muffler ..and leave the other alone [stock] to cover all the base… now what size hole’s do I use the 1911 in 45 acp or use the wifes 38 spl.. …orrrrrrr some of each …big one- a small one- a big one- a small one …NOW her comes the big one ….since I have a muffler on each side …ready …do I shoot holes in the left side or the right side …this is all so hard to think about …HELP I WANT TO BE P.C.
LOL…good post, Doug….actually one of your better, least offensive ones!
But tell me….which end did that strange noise come out of?….with a guy like you it’s hard to tell.
yawn… zzzzzzzzzz…..
Damn all this rain!…I can’t ride “The Night Train”…..and I’m bored, so let’s turn over a rock and see what kind of slimy little critter crawls out…..
My goodness!…is it your goal in life to insult, call names, and attack absolutely EVERY poster who has a different opinion on this subject than you do, Doug?
Is your bloated ego STILL so bruised by my demonstrating what a totally dishonest liar you are, that you want to constantly lash out at all others who dare to express their differing opinions from yours?
Are you even aware of this overwhelming compulsion that seems to have developed in you?
Let’s take a look at your offensive behavior….and, to save time, we’ll just go back exactly one month ago from today….although there are many, many other nasty, bitter liberal-type attack posts, that we can go through if you’d like…it would be interesting to hear the explanations you might put forth….kind of like studying the sociopathic thoughts of John Wayne Gasey, or Jeffrey Dahmer….or even your messiah, the “king of the world, president for life, and grand poo-bah of the known…and YET to be discovered, universe….obama-bin-lyin’….
One month ago, today…in a typical exchange….
March 18….Digger posts that he thinks loud pipes are an additional safety factor for riders….You, Doug, write one of your most UNOFFENSIVE replies to him, but, then ruin it by trying to embellish YOUR opinion by adding the last, dubious, statement saying that you’ve had “too many cagers act aggressively towards me when I am on a bike”….now, your have used this statement in a previous post, so presumably this statement, somehow, is an argument against Digger’s opinion, and indicating that Digger’s loud pipes actually work AGAINST the validity of his opinion….yet, you readily admit that your bikes are NOT loud, or at least not “obnoxiously so”….so, if you have had so much trouble with aggressive drivers, how do you explain your lack of “obnoxiously” loud pipes creating such aggression from cagers toward you….the “quiet biker”?
Now, admittedly, you HAVE blamed other “loud pipes” bikers causing the cagers to become upset, and take their aggression toward the “loud pipes” bikers, out on you….possible…However, I have a much more plausible theory…I think that it has nothing to do with “loud pipes” at all….more probably the “aggressive” drivers are people that know you…possibly even neighbors…that recognize you, and see this as an opportunity to “run you off the road”…or better yet, into the ditch!…I think THAT is much more believable than that flimsy piece of fiction you keep trying to pass off.
Then, Digger replies with the one word,,,”LIBERALS!!!!!!” , possibly indicating his frustration that “liberals”, especially ones like YOU, will NEVER accept another’s opinion, or their “arguments”, without having to add “the last word”, trying to indicate that they are…somehow… “disproving” the posters opinion….
Anyway, Digger’s seemingly exasperated remark, “LIBERALS” seems to mysteriously enrage you….yet, you ARE a liberal!….so, why so enraged?…and you then reply to his post with a a typical mean-spirited liberal “attack”, saying that “it’s always been low-rent, white trash rednecks, who are jealous….or rich republican soccer moms in their escalades and excursions…”
In that one, highly suspect statement, you disparage 1. low income, Southern people..2 “rich” people (a favorite attack target of your hero, the Mau Mau descended, obama ) 3. Republicans…which, being a lying liberal to the core, THAT one is understandable.. 4. Women, and particularly those who have children, who may, or may not, just happen to play soccer…
Now, to point out… again… why I know you are such a dishonest person, and a liar, please explain to me…Digger…and the other posters who you have so offensively attacked in numerous other posts, just HOW you know that all those mysterious cagers who have acted so “aggressively” toward you were all “low-rent white trash red necks…or rich republican soccer moms…”…..while the rest of us have only your “word” as to the validity of these mysterious cagers ever even existing, except in your mind….which is a pretty big “leap of faith” to ask of any non-liberal, considering you all worship obama…the “Shuck-and-jiver-in-chief”, and “reported” Guinness World Record holder for non-stop, continuous lying… LOL (It’s a JOKE, Doug…he probably IS the record holder for non-stop lying, but, I don’t actually KNOW that he holds that Guinness record… it IS possible, but, like all his other past histories and associations, he has sealed up all THAT information about himself also. lol )
Then, just for the sake of “argument”, suppose we all give you the benefit of the doubt, that those cagers DID exist….just HOW do you know that they were all “low-rent white trash rednecks….or rich republican soccer moms….”?…..Did you actually have the opportunity to talk with the “rednecks” and ask where they lived or what they paid in rent”…or, what about the “rich, republican soccer moms?…I would ask you again…did you talk with these mysterious women?…ask their income?….political affiliation?….did they have children…and, if so, did those children actually PLAY soccer?
Admittedly, there are occasions, when humor or a wry sense of humor does allow for some “slack” to be given by readers, but, in your case, since you have this compulsion to readily attack any, and all, that disagree with you, and, in the past have posted deliberately false and untrue statements and statistics, and seem to be using this thread, and your attacks on everyone, as somehow, validating your existence, it seems only fair that you prove…as best you can…that you are NOT just lying…again…and again….and again.
Now, THAT is just one day, and one poster, picked at random….imagine the possibilities and the numbers of other posters that we could review…but that would take WAY to long.
It’s clear that you don’t like me…and that’s understandable as I have identified you as the “cyber bully” that you are, and I AM the one who showed everyone your dishonesty, but, if your “plan” is to “hang out” and wait to ambush me whenever I stop by to post…even when it is not directed directly at you, then all I can say is…I think I’ll start stopping by a LOT more, and you and I can bore the crap out of everyone else with our posts, though I think that would be quite tiresome, as we have already “gone at it”, and, despite your denials, and cries for me to “show you MY proof” (of your dishonest statements and deliberate lies), I have done so…one only needs to read the past posts between us to see it…but those posts grow too long, as my information proving your lies far out numbers any false “facts”, spun by the obama regime, and which you seem to regard as “gospel”
You, with your lies, dishonesty, and vitriolic personal attacks on others with differing opinions, are quite vexing, and since you…like all lying liberals…. will never acknowledge the truth…EVER!….you, as a debating foe, have become useless….like a used condom….you’ve served your purpose, and one usually doesn’t want to “revisit” the issue….but, YOUR mileage may vary.
If you really think that everyone else is interested in what YOU have to constantly say, I have a news flash for you….THEY AREN’T!…why don’t you simply shut up and take a break…READ other people’s posts, but don’t feel that YOU simply HAVE to always “counter” every single one of them….you’ll probably calm down….A LOT!….might even stop drooling….and your pedophilia would probably be much easier to control.
However, if it is your intent to haunt this thread, abusing anyone, and everyone, who happens to disagree with YOUR opinion, and posts their opinion in a NON OFFENSIVE way, then attack them for DARING to disagree with you…OR, you intend to attack me when I address someone’s post…NOT because I disagree with them about loud pipes, but because they, in a typical liberal fashion, imply that anyone who LIKES “loud pipes”, is somehow lacking in intelligence, stupid, or somehow “lower in class” than anyone who DOESN’T like “loud pipes”….of course your pipes don’t count because, while NOT stock, YOURS are louder than stock, but, “not obnoxiously so”…right?
So, if that’s what you want, then, as “Doc Holiday”, said to “Johnny Ringo”, in the movie “Tucson”…..
“I’m your huckleberry”…..
P.S….Doug, I guess I should actually “come clean” here, and “clear up the mystery”….It’s true….I DON’T LIKE YOU, EITHER! …and, by the way…FRED WAS RIGHT! LOL
P.P.S. “Roy”….directly from the “mountain”, and very simply put, to answer YOUR question…”stock/factory” exhaust pipes are neither “conservative” nor “liberal”…because they are inanimate objects….
HOWEVER, the restrictive, un-elected bureaucrat written, government forced mandates of ANY particular decibel level…the “rules” themselves…. ARE politically motivated, and, in this particular case, the EPA…especially NOW, under the illegitimate impostor, “king obama, the magnificent”, WILL become more and more restrictive, (less and less freedom of choice…it’s the liberal way ) and therefore, in fact, ARE “liberal”….
Another example of the “politics” of an inanimate object would be a gun…to have and carry it, to use it for self defense, or the defense of another, is “conservative”…a free individual choice… and a guaranteed right under the second amendment….to control, limit it’s ownership, or take it away, is definitely stealing the freedom of choice of a citizen…is “liberal”, imperils an individual’s right to self defense….especially those of us who are often in close contact with the unwashed mobs of obama base voters, in and around the cesspool formerly known as Detroit….and is in DIRECT CONFLICT with the Constitution, and the rights of all citizens to keep and bear arms….and is an expressed liberal/socialist goal, and openly stated only three weeks ago by the lying, dishonest liberal senator, Chuck Schumer, of the socialist state of New York.
As I have repeatedly stated…EVERYTHING is political now….get it?
LOUD PIPES SAVE LIVES!…..class dismissed….lol
just so pol-o-tic-o , never answer the question …it’s the all in-port-ton …quest- chon..do I need to shoot holes in my mufflers .. or NOT … a little help here would be nice …folks ..learned ones .. steep in wisdom ..or is this so far beyond that I need to go up the mount-ton and ask the wise old monk about mufflers ???? he was stumped by the tire question …
fred, you said (among other nonsense):
“…Doug asserted that publicly admitting he doesn’t understand something would be embarrassing to him….”
i did *NOT* say that. far from it. i said i would be embarrassed to admit i didn’t specifically understand what roy said. there’s a big difference.
i further clarified that i not only understood the point you were making, and agreed it could become embarrassing to fail to admit your ignorance, but that this is specifically *not* one of those instances. but, you have made it patently clear that you have a hard time reading and understanding what’s being said. ;~)
I thought Roy might be making an interesting point but I don’t understand “new speak”, and I said so.
Doug asserted that publicly admitting he doesn’t understand something would be embarrassing to him.
I made the point that not admitting when one doesn’t understand something will eventually lead to oneself becoming a public embarrassment. I don’t know if Doug will now understand that point or continue to embarrass himself publicly.
Anyway Roy, thanks for the clarification. I will try and read up on “new speak” so I can follow you better.
Do you think it’s too early for “Rosetta Stone” to have a program out? 😉
fred, what, exactly *was* your point? other than that you are a troll or an idiot, or both?
Thanks for illustrating my point so well Doug.
Doug – Fred .. I try to do as few words … its the ” new speak ” that is going around now .. with ” twit ” the thing its carrying over to day today.. so I will redo it ..anyway just asking if everyone is making mufflers so ” pol -o- tic ” then what side is stock pipes on ?? as just by nature not by any one reading anything into to …again stock = conserve ?? and open = liberal ?? .. just a thought to ponder …
normally, i would agree. in this case? not so much…
in this case, i believe you know *EXACTLY* what roy said, but you simply want to attack the messenger….
if you truly don’t understand what roy was saying, my condolences…
People who go through life too embarrassed to admit it when they don’t understand something, usually end up understanding little.
As a result they become public embarrassments who lack enough understanding to even know it.
fred – seriously – you don’t understand what roy is saying? i’d be embarrassed to admit that in public. ;~)
Roy. Could you proofread before you post unintelligible questions? I think you might be making an interesting point but, honestly the abbreviated …. style isn’t a language I understand.
I need to know …are quiet pipes ..conserve and ..are loud pipes ..liberal .. buy nature quiet, factory = conserve …. changes, loud = liberal … any ideas on that …
dan babbles:
“LOL….do ANY lying liberals EVER stop whining?….easy answer….NO….”
and then babbles and whines even more… all cuz someone made a joke. and dan talks about OTHERS whining – lol! a clear case of the pot calling the kettle black if i ever saw one. :>)
LOL….do ANY lying liberals EVER stop whining?….easy answer….NO.
Greg, if you’re so disenchanted with “Bubba’s” advice, why don’t you take that early ’50’s Airstream down off the cinder blocks, lube up those rusty axles, and move to a “better” neighborhood.
As you can easily see from the many other hateful, previous posts, there are several like minded, know it all, bigots like you around, with exactly your mentality…or lack of it….very probably, many of them have parking spots right beside their own “double-wides”, and would certainly welcome the company, as their own nasty personalities have probably run off anyone with an open mind, and a taste for freedom.
It’s worth checking out….you might become a better person….doubtful, but at least one can hope….as in “hope and change”…..hmmm, now which lying liberal said THAT? LOL
Loud pipes save lives!
Loud pipes save lives, never cook meth without a fire extinguisher nearby, chicks with tramp stamps and missing teeth are are less likely to be disgusted with you, helmets are for wimps. Just a few of the things I’ve learned from my neighbor Bubba at the trailer park.
You REALLY need to ask this question???
guy g. maybe a 5 track sound track ..one for rap/hip hop for the hood safety.one for easy listen mel/frank/ or wayne … one for death metal for the other hood ..one with johnny cash for the woods hood, and one with one -ton tomateo by chech and chong for the other hood …with a full face your good to go …
I find you can’t paint with a broad brush when it comes to load pipe. I never leave factory pipes on my bikes, but I almost always leaves the baffles in the aftermarket pipes, so louder than factory but still well within the legal limit. One of my buddies drove a Honda with straight pipes, it was the most annoying bike I have ever heard. Gave me a headache every time we rode, he wore earplugs, which drives me crazy. Are you using load pipes for my benefit? Now my brother rides a Harley with short straight pipes that are very load. Doesn’t bother me at all. So it isn’t just the decibel of the pipes but also the tone. I hate four cylinder bikes with load pipes, sound like a blender ready to explode, but most Harleys and some other V-Twins have the right tone. Before you all jump on my for bashing metrics, I ride a Kawi Nomad, so I have no brand preference. I have owned and ridden most brands over the years and love them all…
Loud pipes can save lives if you are in the ideal situation but so can a bull horn but you don’t see people carrying bull horns while traveling by the street although bull horns are considerably less annoying. Loud pipes are inconsiderate and obnoxious to say the least and I hope the loud pipe trend dies in the near future.
guy g, if your pipes are so loud it makes you feel as tho you are intruding, then why are you doing it? especially since you acknowledge it’s no deterrent to someone pulling in front of you? do you enjoy being anti-social?
don’t get me wrong – i love the sound of a nicely piped bike, and all three of mine are louder than stock. but not obnoxiously so…
christine, you said:
“…I respect others’ dislike of the sound and am very careful not to rev my engine or keep it going too long before I ride off. I try to get it done quickly and get out of the neighborhood….”
so, let me understand this – you are respectful of the folks that live near you, but fuck everyone else! does that sum up your attitude correctly?
Gee Roy
won’t that just make you want to ride through neighbor hood; maybe with a bell sound – so the kids will come running for the ice cream.
My dam pipes are so loud that when riding around a town event I feel as if I’m intruding into area. They don’t prevent someone from pulling out in front of you, because they didn’t see you.
A lot of this discussion seems to have evolved into preference. I LOVE the sound of loud pipes…the louder, the better. Bring it on!! It’s those whiny crotch rockets that drive me CRAZY. They zoom around late at night when the roads are clear of traffic and I can’t sleep. Most of the Harleys are off the road by then…occasionally you hear one or two coming into the neighborhood.
Anyhow, there are 5 Harleys, including mine, just on my block. When I hear one or two of them coming down the road, I thrill to the sound. I’ve always loved the sound of motorcycles which is one reason I learned to ride. I guess it’s like music…I hate Bruce Springsteen…his voice is ugly to my ears…but I love the sound of a loud Harley engine. Music to my ears!! Just sayin!
I respect others’ dislike of the sound and am very careful not to rev my engine or keep it going too long before I ride off. I try to get it done quickly and get out of the neighborhood. Fortunately, I have some very laid back neighbors!
i don’t worry about your sick loves, digger. those who babble insane comments such as you are going the way of the dodo bird. we’re crying cuz we’re laughing so hard at your ignorance! ;~)
We love it when a LIB cries on himself!!!
sorry digger, it’s always been low-rent white trash rednecks, who are jealous of the fact that i am enjoying myself, and have more maneuverability. or rich republican soccer moms in their escalades and excursions… ;~)
p.s. one more thing ..you will all [ loud pipe people ] ….. the nat highway traffic administration [ NHTSA] has published a ” NOTICE OF PROPOSED RULEMAKING FOR FMVSS NO. 141 ” — ” MINIMUM SOUND REQUIREMENTS FOR HYBRID AND ELECTRIC VEHICLES ” which includes motorcycles …it has yet determined if bikes emit sound levels that adequately allow pedestrians to detect them ….so you might need to add a speaker system to your bike to make it louder …
track pipe and street pipe ..do not compare with NO pipe … its all the state’s decibel limit one could be 110 db at 15 mph at 15 ft away ..another like fla. is 80 decibel because it goes by the ” federal noise control act of 1972 ” and thats 80db .[sae J-331a].. anybody out there even know what that was ..CLUE [.sub-chapter G of CFR title 40 was the 1976 legislative intent on muffler labels for db.]…it was all model legislation for the EPA to control noise control ..but the office of noise abatement and control [ ONAC] was dismantled in 1981 …before the model laws were field tested .to see if they need to be changed or adjusted .so the fed starting point of 80 db is still out there …for good or bad …no for the after market muffler’s there are no fed laws requiring the presence or maintenance of db labels …and theres no law that says you need to know where they are …title 40 part 205 requires only mancturers ”to make labels in block letters and nurmerals in a color that contrasts with the back ground ” and ” welded,riveted,or other wise permanently attached in a readily visible position” and installed at the time of manufacturer …there is no law to prohibit the end user or mechanics from removing,tampering or obscuring the EPA -DB labels .as they are cosmetic ..the only required marking which may not be defaced or obscured ,are the VIN codes …fed epa laws require owners manuals of all new bikes biult after 1982 to incorpate warning ”tampering with noise control system prohibited ” etc-etc..but owners manuals are NOT legally binding documents …and the limit the exhaust manufacturers use is 96 DB – [SAE J- 2825 ] …so read calif SB435 or EPA part 205 tittle 40 …race bike’s are limited to 99 DB [SAE-J 2825 ] ….
Liberal’s!!!!!!!!